Greek Things and Pastel Horses

Now that I think about it there’s probably a lot of grim dark OC blogs out there who would fit the villain mold outright, but I don’t follow grim dark (because I want to keep my pon stuff happy and silly, if I wanted grim and gritty I’d go see Sin City or something). Early Disney level violence and themes is about as close as I’m willing to get with pony stuffs (for example, there are bones and stuffs like Qua’ga’s creepy magic bony arms occasionally but no blood or organs and stuffs which is why Patches is filled with cotton stuffing). A lot of the villain OC blogs (or blogs with villain OCs in them) I’m guessing take it waaaaaay overboard and just beat you over the head with grim dark just to show you how hardcore and evil they are. But that’s just really lazy writing in my mind.

Aside from typical villain qualifications you've already mentioned, many people seem to assume a character being a demon or a monster in general automatically makes them 'evil' as well. I really dislike that train of thought-- that if a character happens to be a traditionally 'bad' creature or race, they can only be bad/evil themselves. It's a form of overused stereotyping that actually makes for really boring, predictable villains.

That’s the best thing about being a fiction writer/artist/whatever, archetypes can be played with. You can write or design someone in a typical villain mold yet have them not be villains. Like with Thauma you can have a Fanatic type character, but not every Fanatic character you write has to be the villain. Warhammer has a good example of Fanatic hero types with the Empire guys. They are usually full-fledged Fanatic archetype characters (Witch Hunters especially) but because Chaos is usually the “villain” of the story their Fanatic tendencies become simply a tragic flaw (albeit a big one) rather than what makes them a villain. 

What about Thauma herself? I mean she kidnaps children and all that that's pretty "bad guy" behavior.
Anonymous

a-wild-mooshroomtaur-appears:

askmedusapony-mod:

That’s the thing though, it’s not just the actions that makes some-pony a villain or bad guy. I don’t put Thauma in villain territory because she simply isn’t aware that anything she is doing is wrong (or at the very least doesn’t understand why others would see it that way). Thauma actually believes she is doing something good for the children she abducts (or at least she’s being influenced somehow by the Angels to believe that), a villain KNOWS there is something bad about kidnapping kids, but does it anyway because screw the children! I would argue that her Angel friends *could* be villains, but I simply don’t know enough about them to put them in that category. I as a reader don’t know why they kidnap kids and do whatever it is they do with them, if it’s simply for biology/survival’s sake they wouldn’t fit the typical villain mold really because you can’t find evil in something for resorting to its base animalistic instincts. Plus I don’t know if they are very aware of the morality of their actions to begin with,like Thauma they could simply not be aware that kidnapping kids is a bad thing

image

Also, Thauma was made to fit a “villain” archetype that I never considered to be necessarily “evil”, only misguided and funny: 

The Fanatic

"The Fanatic is on a quest for truth — as he defines it.  He’s self-righteous, self-assured, and not afraid to speak his mind and share his opinions.  He is sometimes an anarchist, sometimes an institutionalist — but in either case he refuses to be contained or controlled, though he usually follows his own moral code.  The Fanatic is always focused on the big picture and end goal, and tends to overlook or dismiss collateral damage.  His refusal to compromise will be his undoing."

"The FANATIC: the uncompromising extremist, she does wrong in the name of good. She justifies hers actions by her intentions, and merely shrugs her shoulders at any collateral damage. Anyone not an ally is an enemy, and therefore, fair game. Give up any hope of showing her the error of her ways – she firmly believes you are wrong, wrong, wrong. “

   Fanatic villain would work for Thauma, but there’s a fine line between villain and misguided mook/underling/minion for them. The Fanatic HAS to be the Big Bad of the story, meaning that they can’t have ANY other bad guys or villains above them commanding them or otherwise being bigger and badder than them (they can serve abstract evils like a dark god or something, but said dark god cannot then literally come down and fight the heroes as a physical being, because that then bumps The Fanatic down to just a misguided super minion).

   Thauma on her own without any other influences would certainly be a villain (albeit a very sympathetic one). But the Angels being the ones “in charge” (or at least being the ones she looks to for guidance) bumps her out of villain territory for me. A villain is the big bad of the story, there cannot be anyone above them giving them orders or otherwise making them do the bad things they do, multiple villains only work if they’re all evil independently and equally and aren’t bossing each other around (or at least they aren’t letting themselves get bossed around by the others). It’s why Loki is still technically the villain of Avengers 1 (Even though we all know he’s serving Thanos) and Ronan becomes the villain in GotG. Even though they *might* be serving bigger bads than themselves they’re still the villain of the story because said bigger bad (Thanos) never shows up to fight the bad guys himself.

thehornlessminotaur:

Shortsword n Pals.
When I get more free time I write up some more stuff here.



Another Caravel sighting! I can imagine the both of them pestering poor Ahab to death, “What’s this big old rope for? Did you *really* beat up a Kraken with your bare hooves? Why all the lemons? Why’s your Cutie Mark a weird helmet thingy? When are you going to let us steer the boat? How come you never teach us anything cool?”

thehornlessminotaur:

Shortsword n Pals.

When I get more free time I write up some more stuff here.

Another Caravel sighting! I can imagine the both of them pestering poor Ahab to death, “What’s this big old rope for? Did you *really* beat up a Kraken with your bare hooves? Why all the lemons? Why’s your Cutie Mark a weird helmet thingy? When are you going to let us steer the boat? How come you never teach us anything cool?”
What about Thauma herself? I mean she kidnaps children and all that that's pretty "bad guy" behavior.
Anonymous

That’s the thing though, it’s not just the actions that makes some-pony a villain or bad guy. I don’t put Thauma in villain territory because she simply isn’t aware that anything she is doing is wrong (or at the very least doesn’t understand why others would see it that way). Thauma actually believes she is doing something good for the children she abducts (or at least she’s being influenced somehow by the Angels to believe that), a villain KNOWS there is something bad about kidnapping kids, but does it anyway because screw the children! I would argue that her Angel friends *could* be villains, but I simply don’t know enough about them to put them in that category. I as a reader don’t know why they kidnap kids and do whatever it is they do with them, if it’s simply for biology/survival’s sake they wouldn’t fit the typical villain mold really because you can’t find evil in something for resorting to its base animalistic instincts. Plus I don’t know if they are very aware of the morality of their actions to begin with,like Thauma they could simply not be aware that kidnapping kids is a bad thing

Oh and one more thing that makes a villain a villain. A villain plots. A villain plans. They *can* commit crimes of circumstance or oppurtunity but not solely. This separates a true villain from random bandits/bullies who pick on weaklings of oppurtunity.

Well, you ask “I have an antagonist guy in my blog who bullies my character! Are they not a bad guy?” there are a few key characteristics that separate a true bad guy/villain from just an angry/mean rival or random mook just there to be an obstacle, at least in my mind.

One, a villain must actively seek or desire the harm, destruction, or subjugation of, be complicit in harming or willing to commit harm to an otherwise innocent party for reasons unrelated to their own or another party’s survival or welfare.

This is a pretty big qualifier. This excludes parties who are actively antagonistic towards each other equally (the other party has to be otherwise neutral to the villain or would be neutral if not for the actions of the villain) like rivals or warring factions. It also excludes characters who commit harm to peeps solely for biological / survival reasons. Which is why I wouldn’t say any of the OC antagonists in AKS have been straight villains, they’ve all been mostly victims of circumstance and have been doing bad things either simply for their own survival or the survival of their people.

Two, the villain must be consciously aware of the fact that what they are doing is morally wrong, and either does not care about this fact, actively spites any form of morality/authority, or convinces themselves that these wrongdoings are not their fault.

This one gets into the heart of why villains are villains vs just a regular person doing bad things on accident or being controlled into doing bad things and whatnot. A villain is fully aware that what they are doing is wrong, either they embrace their evilness or they project this evilness onto others (like the bad guy in Hunchback). This is why Stheno and Qua’ga are true villains, they are fully aware that petrifying peeps for all eternity and bargaining for their souls are bad things to do. But in Stheno’s case she simply doesn’t care about the consequences, and Qua’ga very much embraces her villain-ness and loves doing bad things.

You know? I can’t really think of many honest to goodness fan made bad guys. I can find plenty of blogs about canon villains, or evilified canon characters/pre-G4 pony villains, but no straight up “This is a bad guy I totally made up” bad guys. The only one I can think of off the top of my head is Red Eye’s creepy antagonist, and my own (even though I don’t use them NEARLY enough, maybe in a future arc I’ll give Meddy a bad guy to go all super gorgon mode on or something).

I think I found ask-wiggles' true identity

Also, I got a pretty generic request yesterday that I didn’t have an idea for but after driving home I got an idea for it. Maybe next Tuesday I’ll doodle it (if I remember)